Sibelius 7 is out.

[Ed Sharpe]

Sibelius 7 is out.


www.sibelius.com/products/sibelius/7/index.html

[Kevin]

Thanks for the link Ed.

I for one am not that impressed by the quality of the sounds. I will stick to my EWQL! Also it is a bit late to give Sibelius xml capability, I needed that years ago.

[Deleted]

I don't think the demos are as good as you can get with most MIDI keyboards these days. However, the look and feel is more intuitive and more like Windows 7 and it has a 64bit version, which I have been waiting for!

[michaelm]

Still running Windows XP, which doesn't meet the requirements, so that leaves me out.
Not ready to buy a new system at this time; but when I do, it will be a MAC.

[wizzarts]

Alot of suggestions I wrote to Daniel are now built-in. That's cool, - but some important things are still missing...
But now I don't need Finale anymore being that I can select pitch before duration :-) That's what I was waiting for...

Still keep my EWQL-Lib

[steve]

The PDF feature and print preview are the biggest improvements I see so far other than the cosmetics, over which we could argue whether or not they are in fact improvements at all. I am playing around with the demo and will continue to do so, but I like it so far. No major complaints except the full screen business in Mac is acting up. But that's why I don't buy v.0! Hopefully it is something they can address in a minor update.

As for the sounds, I haven't listened to the demos but who cares all that much? Is anyone really expecting them to sound like a live symphony orchestra or band? We will continue to do what we must to get the best sounds possibly with whatever we have available to us.

Also, as of this moment, ScoreExchange states that they do not accept Sib 7 files. I'd like to think this means they CANnot presently do so but are working full speed on adapting the necessary software... I've written them, but again, it is not surprising if there is a slight delay between the new software and its acceptability in online databases. One disadvantage, I suppose, of an outside company running the site as opposed to Sibeliusmusic being run by the folks who upgrade the program!

[Kevin]

I have just had a look at the demo. Most of the differences that I can see are bring stuff to the front page that were in the tabs before. As for the PDF it was just as easy to do it with Print/PDF before. certainly the extra expense does not warrant that.

I am sure that in time SE will have to accept Sib 7 files. I am sure they will wait to see just how many units are sold to see if it justifies the extra work/cost incurred in doing such a thing.

[Kevin]

Just been having a play moving stuff between 7 and 6 using XML, guess what? It did not want to know. I opened a sib 4 score and when I tried to close sib 7 down it crashed!

[steve]

Jul 29, 2011 13:36:21 GMT Kevin said:

I have just had a look at the demo. Most of the differences that I can see are bring stuff to the front page that were in the tabs before. As for the PDF it was just as easy to do it with Print/PDF before. certainly the extra expense does not warrant that.

If you say so. Between sticky tuplets, tabbed parts, in house PDF (which is far easier than it was before for me), the improved text handling (which just might turn out to be the best improvement this version!), etc there's enough for me. I'm just waiting for an update or two to iron out the inevitable wrinkles.

Jul 29, 2011 13:36:21 GMT Kevin said:

I am sure that in time SE will have to accept Sib 7 files. I am sure they will wait to see just how many units are sold to see if it justifies the extra work/cost incurred in doing such a thing.

When I wrote them they explained that they use the internet version of Sibelius to encrypt the files for publication - Sib 7 has no such internet version as yet... I'm sure they will find a solution or close shop. Justification is a given if they intend to remain in business. In years to come as other versions of Sibelius come along they surely will not expect folks to continue to export to an increasingly older version of the program.

[Kevin]

So has anyone taken the plunge and bought it? If you did what turned your head/ear?

[michaelm]

My system can't handle the requirements; still running XP. I'm fine with what I have at this point. I'd rather spend the money on some new sounds or investing in a MAC.

[steve]

Aug 10, 2011 14:02:02 GMT michaelm said:

My system can't handle the requirements; still running XP. I'm fine with what I have at this point. I'd rather spend the money on some new sounds or investing in a MAC.

Sounds like a logical progression - no point buying what you won't be able to enjoy anyway... Might as well get a nice powerful new Mac, then you'll be able to enjoy all the sounds you can get your hands on, in and out of Sib 7. Not to mention compared to a few years ago, the prices on the newest Macs have actually come down relatively speaking.

I'm hearing nothing good about the sounds and may even wait to install them, but I'm loving the demo for notation purposes. Very good workflow possible. A few things take some looking for as they hide in their new places, but once found, everything is easily accessible via the keyboard which makes things very fast and easy for me.

As a self-tutorial with the software, I'm sketching out some ideas for a symphonic tone poem of sorts [since I had no choice this morning - I was compelled beyond my mortal strength by that which creates to get to work as soon as I got home!].

[Kevin]

What about the 30 day trial, has anyone had a go? I must admit that I have tried but finding my way round takes such a long time and as time is of the essence for some of my work I tend to go back to Sib 6!

[juan]

I downloaded it a couple of weeks ago.

I used it to refurbish an old Sib 3 score, and actually it took me more time to have it done than it would have taken me on Sib 6, so I agree with you that if time is an issue and you are used to sib 6, perhaps is not worth.

However, while I used sib 7, I understood how the new UI will speed up score engraving in the long run, once our brain is rewired to the new ribboned-tabbed interface, after some initial toddling our way about. If you are a keyboard short-cut guy, it does not matter that much, because you would be using the short-cuts anyway, which are the same.

Also, much improved score, parts and version management.

I will not be upgrading because I only upgraded to Sib 6 seven months ago, and my rate, volume and complexity of work does not warrant an upgrade for the sake of speed (I guess benefits of a more agile UI have some sort of threshold to make the upgrade worthwhile, for me, I'm well below that threshold; for others, their first sib 7 large orchestral score complete with parts will be a chore and they would have done two or three of them on sib 6, but it will pay off).

If time is a matter of concern, I would suggest that you get well acquainted with Sib 7 when your work load is low, and only switch when you feel you can actually take advantages of the time-saving improvements of sib 7.

[deepdrummer]

I have been playing with the demo version of Sibelius 7 for a couple weeks now and I'm sold for sure. A bit of time to find everything but it has a lot of plusses for me and one really seems to be stability. I always had a problem with version 5 hanging and crashing when asked to share with the "reaper" track recording program. Problem solved with 64bit Sibelius 7. The sounds in the demo do not include the same sounds of the released version which is said to include the pop and rock sounds (which I bought for version 5). That alone should be a major selling point. I'll be upgrading as soon as possible without question.

[Kevin]

Is that right about the sounds then?

[deepdrummer]

From the Sibelius Website at:
www.sibelius.com/products/sibelius/7/index.html
Sibelius 7 includes more than 38 GB of professional content, including a specially recorded symphony orchestra, rock and pop instruments, and much more. This exclusive content is only available in Sibelius 7.
The demo download is 360 Megabites.
The professional sound library included with Sibelius 7 is more than 38 gigabites.
Since I still only have the demo because I am in a remote location with a download cap of 20 gigabites a month I can't download the new version 7 in full, so I still need to continue using version 5 to get decent playback sound at least until someone can verify that they actually have stock on the upgrade. One site I was just lookign at states that they cannot check stock and the best way to check is to place your order. Uh huh. Not happening.
But obviously the math clearly indicates that the best sounds are not included not to mention the lack of available instruments and sounds one can assign with the demo.
Another quote from the Avid site:
IMPORTANT: It will take many hours to download Sibelius 7, requiring approximately 65 GB of hard drive space for installation (24 GB for download installer, plus 40 GB for sound library installation). If you are concerned about internet caps or time constraints, we highly recommend the boxed version.
65 gigabites for the release as apposed to 360 megabites for the demo. Yes, that's right about the sounds for sure. Confirmed. I just wish I could find a copy so I can put version 5 to rest. The demo only saves to Sib 7 format as well so it's not handy at this point but it has potential once I get to version 7 upgrade.

[juan]

The demo only saves to Sib 7 format

Not true, you can export to previous versions of Sibelius.

[deepdrummer]

Ahhhh. Good to know. I simply tried file save as: I never even thought of export. That will make the wait for the full version much better. Playback of the demo is still lacking but I like the new version 7 actually much better now and now that I know I can save, my last 10 days of the trial should be good. I never had a reason before to export to an older version and didn't realize it was done that way. Now I am really going to dig my heels in and torture test it in a multitasking musical environment. Buying version 7 is already a given and my biggest decision now is whether to bundle the upgrade with Audioscore ultimate but I suppose that should be another thread?
Thanks so much Juan for leading me in the right direction. Much appreciated!!

[deepdrummer]

Week 4 of torture testing Sibelius 7 Demo has me sold totally. Moments ago I w2as working on a chord progression for guitar and then I thought I'd add a guitar (tabs) track below the notation track which showed the chord names and diagrams as well. Sudenly I thought for the lead I could paste some graphics of the guitar fretboard into the bars corresponding to the chord changes where I would show the relative Pentatonic Minor scales to allow me a faster learn time and to give me ideas on how to approach the lead part. WHile I was looking for a button which would allow me to put a graphic in there I ran across a button marked scale diagrams. I clicked that and found that I could create my own scale diagrams similar to chord diagrams. Further into it I found you could change the scale diagram to show from 5 - 15 frets. Although most scale diagrams are not included in the demo, I am going to assume that they will be included in the release. Regardless with this tool I can make my own and quickly constructed a complete A minor pentatonic scale diagram to place above that particular staff relative to the active chord. It's not a matter of IF I will be purchasing this program, it is simply a matter of when. I would estimate This coming week when the Demo runs out since I will then be suffering from Sib 7 withdrawal symptoms and I sooo no longer want to go back to version 5 now. Check out this A Pentatonic minor scale diagram I created in seconds (Again I strongly believe the release will include these ready made since when I went to name it, the name already existed in the demo. Here is a shot of the scale diagram I created anyway using the "scale diagram button" at the following link: i225.photobucket.com/albums/dd18/DeepDrummer/AminorPentatonic-1.jpg

[Kevin]

I am sure that Sib 7 fills a lot of requirements. I am yet to be convinced. I just want ease of use and layout tidy up. Sib 6 gives me that. If the latest update gave me amazing playback then I would go for it. The thing with Sibelius is that they try to be something for every one. It would be good for them to provide separate programmes for what someone requires.

I would like a program that gives me a fast input/layout and first class sounds. They say that 7 has been put together with pro sounds but they neglect to say who assembled the sounds etc.

All things considered I will probably get a copy when the bugs are sorted.

[deepdrummer]

I missed out on getting version 6 which must have been an improvement for sure.
I find so many good things about 7, it's a must have for me. Being able to quickly scroll through all tabs by simply scrolling the mouse wheel gives you access to an aweful lot of functions very quickly. Quick access to different plugins on several tabs is also quite cool. I keep finding little treasures in 7 but don't know what was in 6. There are a few minor bugs in 7 yet for sure but nothing found yet that I couldn't work around quickly. For instance, one bug becomes evident in the demo when you're selecting or building a scale diagram is that the scale diagram is partially hidden in it's text box until you check or uncheck the user box. Odd little glitch. One click solution though. I trust the bugs will be addressed rather quickly as 2 updates have already been released. It's not perfect yet for sure but good enough for me to take the plunge. I've yet to hear the actual released sounds. Here's hoping some sounds have been improved. Certainly the guitar sounds have been dissappointing in other versions and there is no reference to improved sounds on those instruments for version 7..

[Kevin]

Can anyone enlighten us as to the quality of the sound files on 7?

[deepdrummer]

I ordered it today. The fact that I just discovered the fact that you can show a keyboard or guitar fretboad on the screen for note input only further justifies my decision. I don't need to use TuxGuitar concurrently anymore for quickly notating chords and such. Just enter it on the fretboard at it notates. Very cool! I also discovered "rewire" a plugin that allows Sibelius to communicate with my tracking program (Reaper). It also can be used with pro tools, Logic, Cubase, Digital performer, Sonar, Cakewalk and Garage Band. While using Reaper to make tracks, I sinply picked Insert/Virtual Instrument/Rewire/Sibelius 7 on a new stereo track and it fired up Sibelius 7 and allowed me to use it to input a track directly from a score into Reaper to mix with a variety of real instrument tracks. This whole thing is really coming together by eliminating the need for a bunch of other programs running while I am working on stuff. Sheesh, I sound Like a salesman. I'm pretty excited about this version. 1 - 3 weeks I would say for delivery but I'll know by the end of the day apparently. Right now with the demo (that will no longer save after the 30 days which are up) I can only get the basic midi sounds but reaper interfaces nicely. The release is going to be so cool. View/ check the fretboard box or keyboard box. Nice!!

[Kevin]

You are getting very excited about it! (Do you get out much!!)

For me all I want is A+ playback that can match EWQL products as closely as possible. All the fret boards etc are of no interest to me as all I use is a mouse to input.

[deepdrummer]

I am somewhat excited and somewhat impatient. Quite honestly I don't even want to fire up version 5 now that I am used to 7 from the demo. I am anxious to hear the sounds as well although I don't expect them to be exceptionally stellar at all. Playback is dependent on a lot of things from a good soundcard to whatever samples you use. If history is any indication the sounds could very well be a bit of a letdown. Of course other sound libraries and such can always be used but I don't need to get too worried about it. No I don't get out much. LOL. I live in the middle of nowhere and am retired and as such I spend time daily on musical things but certainly not all day. A note from the vendor I purchased 7 from on sound:
VST and Audio Units
VST (on Windows and Mac) and Audio Units (on Mac only) are state-of-the-art standards for high-quality instrumental sounds. A huge variety of VST and Audio Unit instruments are available from numerous manufacturers—and Sibelius can play back your score using any of them. The possibilities are unlimited—you can use world-famous sounds such as the EastWest Quantum Leap Symphonic Orchestra, Vienna Symphonic Library, Synful Orchestra, and many others. Sibelius works with Kontakt Player and Kontakt-format sounds as well.
It sounds like a bit of a pain to use other manufacturers sounds although there is no end to being able to get exactly the sound you're looking for.
Obviously everyone has different sound cards, different processors, different speaker systems and so on.
*Disclaimer* Youir particular results WILL vary.
The bottom line is I am sold and on hold while it ships. Looking forward to using it.
I'll be "getting out" tomorrow for a fishing day on the local water. I live a quiet country life nowadays.
I DO like to start my days with a few hours of some kind of musical activity which is not restricted to playing with composition software but occassionally enhanced by it after which I can "get out" at will. All day, any day.
I'm really not trying to sell anyone on Sib 7. I am simply stating my experience with the Demo.
7 lacks nothing in what I need personally. A very imformative write up on Sib 7 is here:
kellysmusic.ca/productinfo~s~SIBELIUS~p~824.htm
I'll give my opinion on the sounds as they come out of my systems when possible and compare to the sounds in version 5 which is all the reference I have but keeping in mind I had purchased enhanced sounds for version 5 as well which are now included in 7 amoung other sounds. Again. I don't expect a great improvement there but time will tell. At this point it's impossible to make a statement on sound quality. Here's hoping......

[deepdrummer]

I received my copy of Sibelius 7 yesterday. Installed the program and then the 3 DVD's worth of sounds (packed). 5 days and it was at my door. Installed and registered in about 2 hours. So I decided to check out the sounds by loading up what I thought was one of my best works and within a few measures I cringed at an obviously odd sound. I had written a D major chord wrong (probably years ago and probably copied and pasted from back then. The point is the difference in sound quality pointed it out immediately. I am 100% satisfied with my decision to purchace this upgrade. The front end alone is amazing enough but the improved sounds and features clinches it. I give it a best buy. Your results of course may vary. I haven't tried very many instruments as of yet with this version but I am definitely looking forward to getting into it in depth. Just my two cents worth. If you expand the mixer to a fuller size, a lot of what you need to tweak sounds is readily avaliable on the mixer. Very cool!!!

[Kevin]

How about posting something without tweaking the sounds so that we can gewt to hear how it sounds out of the box?

[deepdrummer]

OK. I have just started he simplist of pieces from scratch using version 7. I'll convert it to MP3 or something and post it somewhere. Half the problem with that is the sites hosting it lose quality right off the bat not to mention the conversion. Working on it. I'll post it then get back to work. Bass part next I guess. This willl be the first bass part I ever wrote every note instead of modifying some canned riff. I'm going to take my time on this one from scratch. So far, A hammond organ, Acoustic guitar, semi acoustic, drum kit (stadium rock from the pop and rock sounds collection included). It's got a long way to go. Give me a half hour or an hour to post the example. I'll have to delete something from somewhere too. working...

[deepdrummer]

Sheesh, I had to post it on youtube since soundclick didn't like the format or something. Anyway here is a huge improvement on stock guitar sounds anyway.